The other day a friend of mine was over for coffee and a morning chat. As we are both students of The Great Experiment, the conversation took its turn to current political events, most notably The Border Wall. We agree that the Constitution was one of the finest works of expressed human freedom to date, but our talk turned back the clock a bit to the document that made the Constitution possible, the Declaration of Independence.
When in the Course of human events it becomes necessary for one people to dissolve the political bands which have connected them with another and to assume among the powers of the earth, the separate and equal station to which the Laws of Nature and of Nature's God entitle them, a decent respect to the opinions of mankind requires that they should declare the causes which impel them to the separation.
If the Federal Government were equally gung-ho about security at every border and port of entry, it would be understandable and consistent with national security. It is self-evident that this is not the case. If it is the will of the US government to stem the flow of Mexicans into the US, then just say so. America was not founded on the petty niceties of arbitrary statutes, but on the free and open observations and commentary on the way things are.
We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness.
People of all times and places have been jealous of their culture and heritage. History is replete with nations and states trying to keep out the ‘barbarian hordes’. In the past, however, there wasn’t the degree of political correctness demagoguery that we suffer from today.
When justification for a border wall hinges on blatant stupidities such as “needed for ecological protection”, I will have to join others in raising my right index finger and crying, “Bullshit!” It is what our founders would have done were they here today.
He has combined with others to subject us to a jurisdiction foreign to our constitution, and unacknowledged by our laws; giving his Assent to their Acts of pretended Legislation:
When it comes down to it, most Mexicans would rather be in Mexico. Many do stay there in spite of the attraction of the US economy. A solution that has been offered is heavy investment in Mexico in order to make its economy as robust as that of the United States. This would work, if the whole plan wasn’t under the shadow of thievery or the threat of nationalizing the assets created. People leaving to look for work in the north is a safety valve on unemployment and social unrest
Looking at it from this point of view shows that the US does not have an immigration problem, but that Mexico has an emigration problem. The government of Mexico doesn’t see this as a problem at all. Social and governmental services are not being utilized by these emigrants and remittance payments flow back into the Mexican economy. If all those emigrants were to return home, that would cause a huge problem for the Mexican economy, not to mention the social unrest caused by the lack of decent jobs and government corruption. The truth of the matter is that the country of Mexico cannot take all these people back, and they know it. We can expect no help at all from the Mexican government on this issue.
Do all these foreign people working here hold down wages? Of course they do! Arguments to the contrary are totally disingenuous if not outright lies.
Can our political parties do anything to make the situation better for US citizens? The sad answer is no. Each party is internally conflicted to the point of standstill.
He has refused to pass other Laws for the accommodation of large districts of people, unless those people would relinquish the right of Representation in the Legislature, a right inestimable to them and formidable to tyrants only.
The Democrats historically look for votes from the wage earning working class, so all these immigrants should be a shoe in for citizenship and vote with the ‘party of the people’. The major conflict with the Democrats is that the Mexican people have NOTHING in common with the anti-family, anti-god, and pro-abortion platforms of the party. The party conflict with their existing base is that all this immigration is holding down wages, so they will lose their base of support among unions is they support citizenship.
The Republicans internal conflict is that the abundance of low paid workers increase profitability and robust economic growth at the cost of more government expenditures on education and social services. The flip side is a national security issue with lax border enforcement.
He has refused his Assent to Laws, the most wholesome and necessary for the public good.
If each party cannot get its act together, how in the world could anyone expect them to get together on a policy and vision that would be the best for the country?
He has erected a multitude of New Offices, and sent hither swarms of Officers to harass our people and eat out their substance.
Now, we have a Department of Homeland Security. What is their major contribution to making us more secure? A half-hearted attempt to stop the flow of Mexicans into the US. Well, there are also all the unfunded mandates thrust onto business, but that is another topic.
He has called together legislative bodies at places unusual, uncomfortable, and distant from the depository of their Public Records, for the sole purpose of fatiguing them into compliance with his measures.
DHS has been holding a series of ‘public education’ meetings where the purpose is nebulous and the public statements hold no guarantee of effect on the planning or policy.
He has endeavoured to prevent the population of these States; for that purpose obstructing the Laws for Naturalization of Foreigners; refusing to pass others to encourage their migrations hither, and raising the conditions of new Appropriations of Lands.
States that attempt to deal with the problems caused by illegal immigration face totally conflicted opinion from the court system and all the Federal agencies. States that years ago wanted to build a fence were prohibited from doing so and now it is being mandated.
of all ages, sexes and conditions.
In every stage of these Oppressions We have Petitioned for Redress in the most humble terms: Our repeated Petitions have been answered only by repeated injury. A Prince, whose character is thus marked by every act which may define a Tyrant, is unfit to be the ruler of a free people.
Something needs to be done about real security in the US. Starting with kicking out every foreigner who overstayed a visa would be a good start. A legitimate way for Mexicans who want to work here needs to be taken care of post haste.
“Of course I know. It is my business to know.” -The Merovingian
Thursday, December 13, 2007
Turning Back the Clock
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19 comments:
Work visas?
You would think......
Very succinct.
M,
We have discussed the expansion of H-2B viasa ten fold.
In fact, our beloved President suggested just such a thing.
The border wall is an ignorant, pychological reassurance to the folks in New Hampshire that everything is going to be alright. Nothing more.
Don't start me on the hypocrisy of the Mexican government on this.
You and I both know that for a country that subjegates its' people and provides no real opportunity for the poor, they sure seem to enjoy the cash flow back into the interior, don't they? Can you say "Paisano"?
Kurgan
If the U.S. hadn't forcibly bought the southwest after the war, illegals would be crossing from the mexican state of Texas to the U.S. state of Oklahoma. I'm convinced of this because Mexico's government and class culture would be the same. The government corruption and the culture of class identity that groups people as oppressors or oppressed have always reinforced each other. If you grew up like me, watching mexican movies and novelas, you know the concepts of the noble poor and social class are recurrent themes, or even the main themes.
I think Calderon has done well so far, but no Mexican president or politician has the balls to hold their own people accountable on their end. Nobody demands any compromise from them on the issue of migration vs immigration. The three major political parties in Mexico are always fighting and can't agree how best to create jobs, but they do speak in unison to fight for U.S. jobs for immigrants.
In the U.S. we tear each other apart trying to figure out the role of economics, compassion, race,culture, the rule of law, fairness, security, etc in the Great Immigration Debate.
In Mexico the government and the people speak with one voice: 'migrants' should be able to move unfettered to wherever they can find a job, and surely, if you oppose this it must be because you're a racist.
Patricia A.
Patricia,
Revisionist history will not erase "to the victor goes the spoils". In those days, the strongest took what they wanted: ask the indigenous who were here before all Europeans. The maps those days did not recognize political boundries.
Immigrants do move unfettered, that is the point. The US fails to realize that they are not making enough babies to keep their place in the future. The US needs the immigrants just as much as the immigrants need to US.
We agree the wall is stupid. We have more than one now and they don't work.
However, that in no way excuses the Mexican government for failing to invest in its' own people.
They have chosen to rent them at a low cost to the US.
The little kid living with a dirt floor , deep in the jungles of Campeche may well be the next Albert Einstein.
The world will never know unless he comes to the US where he will be provided an opportunity.
The deep divide between rich and poor (5% : 95%) is what is driving the drug trade, BTW. Levels the playing field. With narcotics, it is open opportunity for all.
Kurgan
As I have proclaimed, loudly and to the point of obnoxiousness to all and sundry, the key to the solution of the unlawful immigration problem of the United States lies within the borders of its closest neighbor to the south. Instead of decades of imperialist adventures in the other hemisphere of the globe, our nation's focus should rightfully have been/be on the growing pains of the nations of this hemisphere. Sadly, yet typically, as a result of the capitalist tentacles of corporate entities that permeate our government, perpetuating a laissez faire attitude toward the profit-at-any-cost imperialistic practices of businesses in the United States, many of the countries we coexist with (if domination and bullying can be termed coexistence) rightfully nurture vast reservoirs of animosity and distrust.
As a result, now, when we as a nation most desperately need to be expending our resources to bring our closest geographic neighbors into the 21st century, and social and economic parity with our own nation, we face suspicion and distrust. So much so that, even if our country’s leadership were to fall into the hands of some non-corporate-controlled puppet, and it was announced that our nation would be willing to expend its various resources to their limits in order to assist any representative government of any American nation in establishing the infrastructure necessary to bring equity in quality of life to that nation’s populace, that offer would be suspect.
The answer, as some seem to suggest, does not include the ridiculous notion that every possible future Einstein deserves to opportunity to come the United States in order to prove or disprove his or her potential. And, again, for those of you not paying attention, this is NOT really a discussion of immigrant rights, whether the United States has a need for additions to its labor force, or any of those other popular diversions from the real problem of the miserable living conditions – with no foreseeable hope for any change – that drive persons to accept all the levels of risk that attend making the choice to enter another country unlawfully.
The truth is that walls do work, they do reduce the number of illegal entrants, and in combination with mine fields (air deployed antipersonnel devices are inexpensive, time tested, and highly effective for decades), motion and vibration sensors coupled to heavily armored solar-powered robotic .30 caliber chain guns with overlapping fields of fire, packs of roaming genetically altered mutant attack dogs with GPS enhanced satellite guidance systems, and the declaration of a one mile wide absolute no-man’s land along the entire length of the border they would come close to halting the flow of illegal immigrants into the country. But the further, and most important truth, is that this is treating the symptom and not curing the disease. If you live along the border and not, say, north of Austin or Waco, you have no real feel for the depth of concern that exists. It is not an issue confined to political party affiliation or constrained by the socioeconomic factors that often define the dividing lines of attitudes on issues.
It’s an ugly problem, and as such the solution is going to be as equally unpleasant. Until control of the government of the United States is wrested from the corporations that profit from the conditions that exist in the rest of the Americas as well as the desperate humans those conditions drive north, the symptoms, and not the disease, will continue to be the focus.
Anony,
You are correct, it is not about immigrants rights. It is about our needs and where the tipping point is on the immigrants coming here and their cost outweighing any benefit.
Selfish sounding , isn't it. But, it is what it is.
The money spent to take care of them once there here is a pittance compared to BILLIONS that they contribute to the federal income and social secutity taxes that they pay into and will never claim.
Dirty little secret: When workplace enforcement began in earnest a few years ago, every company that was bringing in the workers began to insist on a Resident Alien card and a Social Security card. They see the cards and file that paper work. They are insulated because they are not sresponsible to ferret ot which cards are good and which are not.
The Social Security Adminsitration knows the workplace of about 98% of every illegal alien in the country.
Next,
You said "The truth is that walls do work"
Uhmm.. no they don't.
1 - You are putting 700 miles of fence up on a near 2,000 mile border. I can point you to the multitude of tunnel's. Do your homework. The Imperial valley fences pushed the traffic into Arizona. What are you going to do about the go-fast boats off Brownsville and San Diego Coasts?
2 - This may come as a shock, but there are a couple of Mexicans who know how to use a ladder and or a cutting torch. I have personally seen both used with great skill.
2 - When is the checkpoint south of Detroit coming up Mr. Uber nationalist?
3 - Unless you are ready to mechanize 37% of all US jobs (IE: the service industry), you need the flow.
4 -Increase the number of H-2B visa's to the roughly 6 million a year that you need. Trust me, they folks coming up stay here because it is too dangerous and expensive to be going back and forth. They want to go home and take the money bacvk to their families and enjoy what they bhave worked for, in their native home. Just as you or I would.
That said, you have a point. Mine fields and .50 cal guns will work comrade.
I know none of this will enlighten you, but it made me feel better saying it.
Kurgan
Difficult - essentially impossible - for the unenlightened to enlighten, so we'll give that a pass as self-aggrandizement. You completely miss the several points. This is not about IMMIGRANT rights it’s about illegal immigration. The facts support the conclusion that walls do work, where they have been put in place, the number of persons arrested attempting to cross into this country unlawfully has diminished. This is not to say, and it was not so stated in the previous, that this is in any way supportive of the current politically expedient so-called “wall,” nor meant to imply that this is a workable solution. In fact, it was hoped that a careful reader would draw a rather different conclusion.
Although there was a bit of satirical embellishment in the previous, the basic point is that if the necessary resources were allocated to making this country’s borders impenetrable, they would be so, regardless of how many Mexicans you know who possess the agility to scale a ladder or the hand-eye coordination required to operate an oxy-acetylene cutting torch. However, other than what is reported to be a growing public consensus that ILLEGAL IMMIGRATION must be stopped, there is no political or financial impetus to accomplish this.
Again, this is not an argument about the necessity for immigrant labor or these alleged billions of dollars that illegal immigrants supposedly contribute to our economy. It is a question of ILLEGAL IMMIGRATION. This nation, similar to the majority of nations that underwent industrialization in the 19th century, does not currently sport a birth rate necessary to provide the uncomplaining masses required to provide the labor force necessary to bolster the outmoded insupportable model of capitalism that is the paragon of the profit driven business world.
Thirty-seven, 48 or even more percent mechanization would be acceptable. One of the very basic points was that until and unless those folk who put profit first are willing to change their business model nothing of consequence will ever be done about the inequalities the drive this illegal immigration engine.
More visas would be acceptable, but again, how does that address the inequities that contribute to the crushingly hopeless future that drives individuals to risk their lives, leave their families, and break the law? Do meatpacking plants really want workers whose unquestioning compliance is not guaranteed by their illegal status?
Your attempts to characterize by using the terms uber and comrade do nothing to enhance your position, and, in fact, contribute nothing. Although they are in keeping with what appears to be a hint of militancy, a rather alarming lack of comprehension, and the presumption that that same lack is indicative of the some innate ability to provide enlightenment.
Anony,
Base argument- Thank you for agreeing with me.
Your first paragraph is acquiescence to the entire argument.
Over simplification will not bring merit to your points, it actually erodes the logic.
The truth is: Your argument, in essence, has some merit. Maybe not in the way it is expressed, but some protectionism is of value.
I am not an open border advocate.
That said, your statement, "The truth is that walls do work", is untrue. New century. Simplistic answers to placate the populace will not solve the problem.
Details-
Point 1. "Self-aggrandizement" can be defined with such statements as: "As I have proclaimed, loudly and to the point of obnoxiousness to all and sundry".
Point 2. When I said, "You are correct; it is not about immigrant’s rights. It is about our needs and where the tipping point is on the immigrants coming here and their cost outweighing any benefit", I thought I had conceded this point, but we can go on.
The underlining self preservation is not immoral, it really is not. I will not fault your base motivation.
Point 3. I won't repeat the assumption that you have not seriously seen the issue first hand. That would be condescending and inappropriate.
What I will do is point out that the barrier technique / full frontal assault land invasion maneuver began to fade with Hannibal.
This is not to say that the Chinese were wrong to build the Great Wall just that they drew simplistic answers given the information at hand. That's why I am trying to help you, so that you can avoid the same mistakes.
Point 5. Okay, I was going to leave it alone, but I have to say it.
When you said "Instead of decades of imperialist adventures.." in line four and then state "The answer, as some seem to suggest, does not include" compounded with the .30 caliber reference, I will make the confession that you fascinate me.
The base Marxisism blended with the Mussolini’s fascism, back to a vanilla socialism is something I haven't really heard before.
Most would think these ideologies are opposed, but somehow, you seem to make it work. I mean, your argument is baseless on merit, worthy on point, but in the end, defeated.
Point 6. I am confused when you say "politically expedient so-called 'wall’ nor meant to imply that this is a workable solution",
I take that to mean that your original point "The truth is that walls do work" is withdrawn?
Clarify please. This careful reader is stumped for your conclusion.
Point 7. Can't argue with the intent of the governed.
If we wanted a workable border solution, we would have had one long before the Minutemen brought it to your attention.
Point 8. You again acquiesce on the economic issues, without even acknowledging my assertions, let alone trying to refute them.
Point 9. Given, the people care now. I get that.
Did ya' get the Detroit reference in relation to the motives behind the issue? No one cared until 9-11.
I am not sure as you didn't address it.
Point 10. When you directly contradict yourself by saying "It is not about the necessity for immigrant labor" and "whether the United States has a need for additions to its labor force", I am confused.
Point 11. Do your homework, it is not alleged. Turn off the news and turn on your library.
Point 12. The point on productivity in a post industrial revolution, I concede. Although you kind of make my point, I concede, comrade.
Point 12. What "new" business model do you propose or are you proposing the materialism and empirio-criticism model?
Point 13. Uhhmm... Visa's make them legal.
Kurgan - out
Are we witnessing an "Enlightenment" here in Brownsville?
Why history repeats itself;
"During the late Middle Ages, peasants had begun to move from rural estates to the towns in search of increased freedom and prosperity. As trade and communication improved during the Renaissance, the ordinary town-dweller began to realize that things need not always go on as they had for centuries. New charters could be written, new governments formed, new laws passed, new businesses begun. Although each changed institution quickly tried to stabilize its power by claiming the support of tradition, the pressure for change continued to mount. It was not only contact with alien cultural patterns which influenced Europeans, it was the wealth brought back from Asia and the Americas which catapulted a new class of merchants into prominence, partially displacing the old aristocracy whose power had been rooted in the ownership of land. These merchants had their own ideas about the sort of world they wanted to inhabit, and they became major agents of change, in the arts, in government, and in the economy."
(plagiarized from a Mel Brooks script)
It's only a matter of time...
Respectfully,
Eddie Haskel
Kurgan,
too many points, especially 12, you lose
nattering is silly
even I can see you didn't get it
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/12/14/AR2007121402039.html?wpisrc=newsletter
Anony,
I had thought line by line refutement was a good technique, but maybe not.
Maybe it is I who still engage in the full frontal assault.
Made me feel better, though.
Eddie Haskell's condescending "Brownsville Enlightenment" comment reminded me of a post I made on my blog on education in the RGV and where our priorities lie.
He kind of underscored the main point of that post.
All starts with education.
Kurgan
http://www.latimes.com/news/local/la-me-pepper14dec14,1,4542675.story?ctrack=1&cset=true
K,
My intention wasn't to patronize the dialogue in question. All points were indeed constructive and worth thought. You are right about RGV education. Many of us have no formal education and account for the majority.
My point is that throughout history, and you can go all the way back to the beginning, nothing changes. What's coming is indeed inevitable.
E.H.
I suppose thats all there is about this topic?
C'mon, bring on the debate!
Debate?
Volunteer militias should go door to door, verifying IDs and cross-referencing soc #s.
All illegals should then be escorted to waiting government appropriated buses, accompanied by armed deputies they will be driven to the nearest land border access, and ejected from this country.
Anony,
If we do that, and deport all illegals, who will be playing the tables at my new casinos?
/s/
Native American
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